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Question Evolution! Campaign heats up the Creation vs. evolution culture war

Written on Thursday, August 25, 2011 by

question evolution video

The battle over teaching evolution in schools has heated up recently with eight anti-evolution bills introduced by U.S. state legislators in 2011.  Also, the prominent creationist group, Creation Ministries International (CMI), launched a Question Evolution! Campaign

internationally, encouraging students to wear “question evolution” t-shirts and hand out “question evolution” tracts in their schools.

The campaign will initially focus on the United States, the United Kingdom, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, South Africa, and Singapore. In the United States, a church lobbyist organization that speaks on behalf of 43,000 plus churches has just embraced the campaign.

The Question Evolution! Campaign will be advanced through the internet, television, radio, joint efforts with other Christian organizations and through an army of volunteers using social media websites.  CMI believes in grassroots efforts rather than top down approaches when it comes to spreading their pro-creation message.

Creation Ministries International has a Question Evolution! Campaign web page which describes the campaign plus it features their “15 Questions that evolutionists cannot satisfactorily answer”.

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  • http://aol Flatcreek

    It takes a lot more “faith” to believe in evolution than it takes to believe that “God created”. Darwin himself said it was a theory, not a fact.

    • Dale

      You’ve got that right!

    • Evan

      God did it, ( faith ), is not a knowledge based assertion that can be tested but a personal belief of a religion no more or less testable than the thousands of other religions mankind has believed in over the ages.
         Your definition of ” theory ” is conjecture. That is not the scientific definition.
      But then, where would a flat creek be without a flat earth?

    • jonr

      Quote, “God did it, ( faith ), is not a knowledge based assertion that can be tested but a personal belief of a religion no more or less testable than the thousands of other religions mankind has believed in over the ages.”

      That’s sort of the whole point. What you just described is a perfect explanation of why people have issues with evolution. It is not testable and it is a personal belief. The point is that those from the religion side admit it. Those from the evolution side do not. Well that’s not true. Most do not. A lot actually do admit it it is based on assumptions and beliefs.

      I should know. I spent 6-years paying lots of money to colleges and universities to get a degree in biology, which was 90% focused on evolutionary biology… and invested over 240 semester hours learning this stuff. So I can saw with certainty that the core of the evolutionary theory of matter to man is based on assumptions and a belief system that cannot be proven. By definition it is a religion.

    • Evan

      Evolution is not a religion in that whether the current understanding of observable data is right or wrong it is still subject to the best understanding of observable data and therefore expected to change to whatever degree the evidence demands.
      Religion by definition is ” belief ” and based on the imagined revelations of the god of that religion or some other mystical mechanism and is not subject to change or it ceases to be what it claimed to be as a method of relating to god as god had revealed or made known.

    • Evan

      jonr : As an aside, how much money and years you spent sitting in a class room is completely irrelevant to whether evolution or religion is true or false.

    • Budman68

      So….you’ve been able to test evolution and can vouch that it actually happened that way?

    • daves

      We still see species evolving all the time and yes – the more fossils we find the more evolution is validated.

    • Ron

      daves: “We still see species evolving all the time”
      Really? Name the last species that evolved into another, entirely new species, which was observed by mankind.
      daves: “and yes – the more fossils we find the more evolution is validated”
      Now name one complete evolutionary fossil chain – by which I mean one with no “missing links”.

    • Jim N. Taylor

      I have the proper answers to all these questions which I would gladly send to any interested E-mail;
      trusttaylor@sbcglobal.net

    • http://rebelforiam.com m. sharpe

      I bet Charles Darwin believes in Christ Jesus now.

    • http://doubtingthomas7.blogspot.com Bill

      It would bet the opposite.

    • Co-opted Confederate

      exactly which ape did we evolve from and where are the rest of his kin, and why are there omany different kinds of us. If we evolved from apes why do we still have apes. if we evolved from pond scum or some other aquatic life form then where and what are are its immediate next of kin. And if there ever was a big bang what made it. or should I say who made it and what was it called then?

      Oh so many questions. But I a guy from Bethlehem can heal the sick and raise the dead I’m on his side til the bitter end. .

    • Alexander Shillinglaw

      Remember this ? ” My thoughts are not your thoughts, and my ways are not your ways.”
      We humans came up with the idea that a day is 24 hours long and a year is 365 1/4 days. To an infinite being, omnicient and omnipresent, how many of our days would make up his day ? If evolution is the correct way man and other species were created, wouldn’t it make sense that God was behind it all ? After all, to Him, one day might be a million years.

    • http://doubtingthomas7.blogspot.com Bill

      Alexander,

      You do make an interesting point. Are you asserting however that the Bible is not literally true?

    • Evan

      We humans had nothing to do with determining the length of day or year; in case you haven’t noticed they are determined by the time it takes the earth to rotate on it’s axis and revolve around the sun. We merely quantified an observable natural occurrence.
      If you want to imagine that a god is behind observable nature, that’s up to you but an imaginary concept is all god will be.

    • http://doubtingthomas7.blogspot.com Bill

      On that note: why would it take God six days to do anything? If God is all powerful it should have been able to do creation in a nano-second.

  • http://www.thoughtsandcommentary.com Dale Netherton

    If you want to question, why not include questioning “faith’ as a means of knowledge? Questioning “unquestioning belief” should rattle a few cobwebs.

    • Joy

      My question is, if we came from the sea and developed into men, women, animals etc. where did that first cell or cells come from that could so perfectly develop into eyes to see, ears to hear, lungs to breathe, stomach to digest food, etc.?? There has to be a superior being there to make such a cell or cells. And also, if we developed from the ape, why is there no half ape/half men here for us to see? Just a few thoughts!!! Evolution is another way to sidetrack our minds away from the CREATOR!!

    • Cat

      Joy-

      Most likely those first cells hitched a ride on a meteor.

      As an anthropology student I can name a few of the “half ape/half men” your seeking off the top of my head, but the most interesting is a hominid called Homo floresiensis. I did a research project on them last year and was amazed at what I learned. Homo floresiensis, aka The Real Hobbit, was found in 2004 in Liang Bua Cave on Flores Island in Indonesia. “Flo et al.” was a 3’ tall creature resembling an ape, but with some unequivocal modern human physiology. She’s the soap opera of the anthropology community, but, bones don’t lie, and she’s passed every study with astounding conclusions. I believe they’re up to around 15-20 individuals so far, but they’re starting to find bones on other Islands as well. They’ve dated these bones from 12,000 – 85,000 years ago, but have found tools dating to almost a million years ago. Google it, whatever your personal beliefs, it’s just cool.

    • Sockeye

      You’ve answered your own question by asking, “how”. As science steps forward almost daily those questions you’re asking are being answered; and yours will be answered in time.
      By not allowing rational thought into the class room, it seems to me, the same folks complaining about obama and his course of socialism (that is dumbing down America) are doing very much the same to stifle intellectuals’ free thought. Much the same as the Dark Ages.
      No church or religious belief has made any notable human advances that I’m aware of, however I’m sure there are some. Well, the alarm clock and coffee do come to mind; thanks to Christian and Islamic monks alike. But by and large religious pragmatists do more to cripple human advancement than promote it. You can’t turn your back on history and say, “That was then and this is now,” when history has a habit of repeating itself. Saudi Arabia is an example, meaning the use of religious beliefs to control its population.
      Certainly there are people that need Godly direction as evidenced by religious edifices about them, but what about others? Don’t forget, there are more Buddhist in the world than there are combined Muslims and Christians. By reading the posts here, people have conveniently ruled them out all together, as if they don’t exist. But how can this be?

    • http://doubtingthomas7.blogspot.com Bill

      Don’t Buddist actually believe that they, themselves don’t exist? I could be wrong .. not an authority

    • Whackajig

      Churches and religious beliefs are the source of the ten commandments and every other moral framework we have. Evolutionary scientists do not teach us the proper way to conduct our lives, that is done in the churches.

    • Evan

      The moral frameworks taught in churches are merely the co-opted values and priorities that have made us a successfully evolved species. Empathy, compassion, trust and many other values are what has co-evolved in our complex societies along with our large well wired brains. Gods and churches need not be involved.

    • Budman68

      The structure of a single cell ALONE is testimony that evolution could not have occurred. The cell cannot function without all the pieces and parts functioning perfectly, and such a complicated structure could not have “evolved” over a period of time.

    • Whackajig

      Horseshit………… a very great many things folks used to believe have been proven false. Your belief that you are right may also be proven wrong. You base your assumptions on the limited knowledge which is not available. One of the signs of true intelligence is the willingness to admit that they might be wrong.

    • dfrank

      I am a Bible believing creationist. I try not to be foolish, though, attempting to paint God into a box, a thing He apparently chose not to do Himself, regarding just how everything was done. If a thing seems impossible to one, he might consider that there is no such thing as impossible with God. By definition He is the boss and can do whatever He wishes, using whatever methods He chooses.

      If there is any degree of evolution or devolution it is still all a part of the workings of God. Do I have proof? Yes, and it is in the definition of the word God. If you can think it or imagine it or dream it or doubt it, God has the power to make it happen.

      Have I ever seen God? No; nor have I ever seen a monkey turn into a man. But, I have seen: a wrist watch, an automobile, and a computer and my seeing those things is proof enough for me to know that out there somewhere there is a watch maker, an auto maker and a person who can make a computer.

      And, the fact that I can see the sky, the dirt beneath my feet and the elements in the heavens are ample proof to me that there is a being out there somewhere intelligent enough and capable of making all these things.

      I call Him “God”: but, by any other name, He would still to be the Creator of all the matter that matters to me.

    • Whackajig

      “By definition He is the boss and can do whatever He wishes, using whatever methods He chooses” so says DFrank.

      If that is so, has He explained his penchant for introducing so much pain, misery and suffering? Especially as inflicted on those who are perfectly innocent?

      No reason has ever been given me to explain why a benevolent God would let the shit go on which exists now and since time began.

      How many people if given the powers of a diety who was able to do any and everything, would inflict on the earth’s peoples the horrible things we have?

    • http://doubtingthomas7.blogspot.com Bill

      Joy,

      You make a leap from “Where did the first cells come from?” to “there has to be a superior being”. If we are to follow your line the one is forced to ask where did such a being come from? What is its origins?

      This is why the Deist argument for God based on origins is flawed. It contains the logical fallacy of begging the question. It proceeds from the assumption the an extra-terrestrial being or force such as God has no begining.

      There is no impartial evidence of such a being or force.

  • Dan

    Hypocrisy comes in all colors, ages, and sexes … Hypocrisy comes in all religious faiths, or those who have no religious faith at all … Hypocrisy is everywhere, every day, and never goes away . . .

    Jesus Christ is never hypocritical … Jesus Christ died for all colors, ages, and sexes … Jesus Christ is the answer for people of all religions and those who have no religious belief at all . . . Jesus Christ is everywhere, every day, and never goes away.

    God sent His Son, Jesus, to be born and live among humans as one of us, to suffer the things that we all go through, and then allowed us to crucify Him. He died on that Cross, was buried in a stone tomb, and rose from the dead on the third day. He did all of this to provide a way for sinful Man to have a means to be forgiven of Sin and to be worthy, in the eyes of God the Father, to have eternal life to enter into Heaven.

    Jesus paid the price for your sins and for mine. To claim this gift of salvation, forgiveness, and eternal life, you must willingly and genuinely accept Jesus as you Lord and Savior. This is a decision that only you can make.

    If you believe that you are a sinner, as is everyone, and you want the peace, love, and joy that comes from having a personal relationship with God, please open your heart and earnestly pray this prayer:

    Lord Jesus,
    I am a sinner and know that I deserve an eternity of punishment in Hell for my sins. I believe that You are the Son of God and that You came to Earth to pay the price for my Sins. I ask You to be my personal Lord and Savior and to come into my heart and completely fill me with your Holy Spirit. Forgive me my sins, cleanse me from all unrighteousness, and abide with me forever. Thank You , Lord Jesus for loving me and saving me !
    Amen

    If you sincerely prayed that prayer, you are now a Christian. The next thing you should do is to find a local Bible-believing, church to help you grow in your faith and to learn more about God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit. The prayer you prayed above is the start and now you should seek to learn more and grow stronger in your faith.

    Avoid so-called “churches” that try to “sugar-coat” what they tell their members. If the church you find does not talk about Sin and Hell or only talks in non-specific terms about Jesus, find a Bible-Believing church instead. Avoid “mega-churches”, as most of them are only in it for the money and tell people what they want to hear and/or preach the “prosperity gospel” to draw people in … Find a small, local church and start attending regularly !

    • R Freeman

      Please give me the book, chapter and verse in the Bible where that prayer you cited is found. I am exhausted trying to find it. I have, however, found dozens of scriptures that tell me there is much more I must to to be saved from my sins. Have you not read them? Do you not believe them? If not, please explain why you do not.

    • Co-opted Confederate

      I believe in Original pro active Prayer Dan.
      sorta like: Jesus what can I do for you to day that will edify you and proclaim your greatness to my fellow man. What can I do to rid my world of evil men who try to force me to believe in things you have taught us are evil. That sorta prayer is what we need now. not old time dogmatic prayer; cause time do change ya know; and our Prayers must keep up with those times

    • http://doubtingthomas7.blogspot.com Bill

      Co-opted,

      Times change? But in the Christian philosophy God never changes. This is where even the Bible itself must be incorrect. If God is omnicient it can never change its mind or regret its decisions. If the God of the Christian faith is truely Omnipresent then times never change from its prespective.

    • Whackajig

      God sent His Son, Jesus, to be born and live among humans as one of us, to suffer the things that we all go through, and then allowed us to crucify Him. He died on that Cross, was buried in a stone tomb, and rose from the dead on the third day. He did all of this to provide a way for sinful Man to have a means to be forgiven of Sin and to be worthy, in the eyes of God the Father, to have eternal life to enter into Heaven.

      Say, how’s that working out? Kinda like ovomit’s hopey changey thing?

  • Gene

    It takes a lot of faith to believe that humans were made out of mud, and the talking snake, and walking on water, and heaven and hell.

    • jonr

      It takes more faith to believe that it all was created from nothing at all. How do you take nothing and have it explode into something? That is 100% illogical.

      Also, if you take the notion that every in the universe was smashed into a spec… what acted on that spec to make it explode? Remember everything in the universe is in that spec. So there was nothing outside to act on it. If you claim something from within acted on it, you have a problem. Einstein proved that in the beginning if everything was a spec, time would have been stopped. So at what time did it explode when time did not exists? The whole idea is invalid.

      Logically if God exists outside our universe and outside time, he can interact with our universe. In evolutionary theory you have to have something from outside the universe cause it. That cause is God. There is no other logical answer. If you have one, the world would like to know.

    • http://doubtingthomas7.blogspot.com Bill

      Why is God a logical answer? You assume that their must be a prime mover, a first event. Then you come to the conclusion that this first event must be the one deity out of the nearly 3,000 humans have worshiped in recorded history that you happen to follow.

      What is the missing link here? How do you get for something must have started everything to the God of the Bible must be true? Even if solely for the sake of argument I were to grant that some extra-terrestrial force might be involved how could you prove that force is the one you purport and one of the thousands of others?

    • jonr

      Don’t you believe that we all evolved from nothing? And later we all evolved from a rock? What is easier to believe? That a being outside this universe interacts with the universe, or that everything started from nothing at all.

      I would very much like to see the equation that starts with nothing and generates everything. Something like 0 * 0 = everything?

      I try and try to get that right, but I cannot. Nothing times something always equals nothing. Maybe I am just bad at math or I haven’t figured out this new math they are teaching these days.

    • http://doubtingthomas7.blogspot.com Bill

      The truth is I don’t know what started the universe. I wasn’t there to witness it. Your working theory seems to be that some extra-terrestrial force was involved. How do you get to God from there? Even if you can how do you get to a specific God?

    • Whackajig

      It seems naieve to believe that man is the highest order of being there ever was.

    • http://doubtingthomas7.blogspot.com Bill

      I don’t think naive is the right term. Show me some evidence that there is a higher form of being and I will consider it.

      The only “evidence” you have is the Bible. A book that was compiled to advance a particular religion and which is of dubious historical accuracy and which even many of that religions followers admit is not 100% literally true.

    • Budman68

      It takes a lot MORE faith to believe that it all created itself out of nothing.

    • Whackajig

      George Bush did it.

  • Steven F

    I don’t have ENOUGH faith to believe random chance created life as we know it, then STOPPED to the extent we don’t REGULARLY observe indisputable evidence of evolution.
    To believe in a creator, I must accept ONE unproven premise(the existence of God). To Believe there is NOT a creator, I must believe so many unprovable premises that I don’t even know how to express the number.

    • Hotfoot

      Yes! If we were all descended from the ‘primal’ mud, why did our evolution from primates stop? Have you seen any humans around lately (the last few thousand years) that was descended (born) from a primate?

    • Jimi B

      Think about it. Why couldn’t have apes decendent from humans? Why humans from apes? The idea of evolution is a cluster.

    • Byron

      In the Whitehouse

    • http://juan-gilberto@hotmail.com El Lobo Solo

      @ Hotfoot:

      Maybe the theory is not evolution, but de-volution. LOL

    • http://doubtingthomas7.blogspot.com Bill

      Or you could accept no unproven premises. Evolution does occur and it still occuring, that is fact. You could make the valid argument that it has not been proven to explain all life and that evolution to the extent possible to explain all life is not proven.

      But it certainly does not prove a supreme being nor does it even suggest one.

    • Whackajig

      Perhaps evolution is in fact God’s way?

      Why cannot people just admit that we do not know what did happen or what will happen in the future?

    • http://doubtingthomas7.blogspot.com Bill

      I will be more than willing to admit that I do not know. But there is scientific rationale for evolution and none for creation. Ergo one should be studied in a science class and the other should not.

  • Evan

    Flatcreek:
    God did it, ( faith ), is not a knowledge based assertion that can be tested but a personal belief of a religion no more or less testable than the thousands of other religions mankind has believed in over the ages.
    Your definition of ” theory ” is conjecture. That is not the scientific definition.

    • jonr

      Religion is testable. All you have to do is die and you’ll have the answer.

      You obviously know very little about logic and philosophy and how it pertains to religion and the historical evidences of the Christian faith. You should read William Lane Craig, Lee Strobel, RC Sproul, etc. and offer rebutals to their arguments… if you can. But I suspect that you cannot.

      Flatcreeks use of “theory” is justified. There are multiple definitions of theory both in lay-terms, professional terms, and scientific terms. No one has to use the scientific definition at all points in time. But theory defines evolution well in all cases.

    • Evan

      Well, if one is commenting on a scientific theory it stands to reason they should use the science definition.

  • mad as hell

    Just remember you can’t create everything
    from nothing as the evolutionists would have
    you believe. The diversity of life on this
    planet cannot be justified by random evolution, ie; “climbing out of the primordial slime”. The beauty of this earth is truly a miracle and I thank God for this amazing gift..everytime I backpack in the
    high Sierras I feel as if I have seen God
    and am truly humbled by the experience.

    • Whackajig

      The next time you see Him, there are a couple of things here on earth which are not quite so beautiful as the mountains, which I would like for him to address in his spare time. I know He controls everything, so it should be an easy task to eliminate some of the pain and strife humans are experiencing.

  • http://none Williams

    Two points: 1) Faith as a means of knowledge is inescapable.
    We have FAITH in the scientific method! FAITH means “trust.”
    You probably have dogmatic religion in mind.
    2) Book such as “Darwin’s Black Box,” by M.J. Behe present a lot of good scientific evidence against the unproven dogma of natural selection without any references to dogmatic religion.

    • http://doubtingthomas7.blogspot.com Bill

      I think you make a valid point. But without a doubt there is more evidence for evolution than for creationism.

      Even if you completely disprove evolution you have not proven creation. It does not follow that it one is false the other must be true.

      The only evidence for Christian creationism is a book written for the sole purpose of promoting that religion. A book which contains a creation story which is not only unplausible but unoriginal.

  • Lloyd

    The Communist party is working overtime in our country, and folks had better wake up, stand up, and fight back. One of the first steps in taking over a country, is to abolish religion. Do away with all churches, and outlaw the bible. Of course, the Koran will be allowed to circulate, and, in truth, the will probably demand that it be read by all.

    • http://doubtingthomas7.blogspot.com Bill

      Really? The Muslim communists are out to get you? Have you ever met a Muslim communist?

  • http://www.questforright.com Linda

    If you will read The Quest for Right you will find out the truth about creation and evolution. Just from looking at the human eye, there is no way that could have evolved. There are many other proofs.

  • R. Cook

    I met a guy the other day that is positive that God is in reality super advanced aliens that seeded the earth at different times causing all the different ages of the developement of life. When I asked him how these so called aliens came into being, he became very angry. I just smiled.

    • Evan

      Beyond the fantasy between your ears how is it that you can know that the religion and god you believe in is the true one among the thousands of gods and religions humanity has believed through the ages. Don’t get angry now.

    • http://doubtingthomas7.blogspot.com Bill

      Well how is that so far removed from Christianity.

      According to the Bible:

      1. God is an extra-terrestrial or alien (meaning not from this Earth)

      2. God is super advanced (Or supernatural)

      3. God seeded the Earth (put people and animals here)

      I could go on but you get the point.

  • am2sweet

    Frankly it takes a really far stretch of faith to think that two atoms just hit just right and bingo the earth is created, we are created, animals are created, plants, oceans, mountains, and deserts are all created. To top that off we are able to actually talk, walk, make things, reason things out, and have children. It’s easier to believe that God did all this because it’s the truth.

    • Evan

      No need to stress your faith with a far stretch because no scientist believe,” two atoms just hit just right and bingo the earth was created ” either.

    • R Freeman

      Yes, and where did those two atoms come from? And what placed them into motion?

    • Whackajig

      Some people cannot abide uncertainty. To cover the subject of our origins, they invent a god that did it.

  • Judy

    God is our creator. I do NOT argue politics or religion but if my children were in school today, and evolution was being taught, I would remove them from school.

    • Evan

      ” God is our creator ” , IS arguing religion.

    • Whackajig

      Judy, Judy, Judy………….. do not feel alone, many others are just as narrow minded as you are.

    • Justin

      The ignorance of people in America is astounding

  • G K

    We seem to have no problem teaching “Creation” vs. “evolution” when it comes to climate change.
    Big government ideologues manufacture their own “Creators” when it suits their agenda.

    • jonr

      That’s a great point. I’m going to start calling all Gore a “climate creationist”. And I will start calling those that say it is a natural pattern, as it matches dozens of patterns like the amount of radiation from the sun, those I will call “climate evolutionist”.

      We need to come up with better names like this. I sure we can find a good name like that just to bug them!

  • WhoCares

    Religion is manmade.
    Evolution is manmade.

    Call upon the King of the Universe, the King of Kings, and He will answer you.

    What a theory that I came from an ape.

    Animals and humans have a soul BUT only humans have a human spirit which can mingle with the HOly Spirit.

    • Evan

      Evolutionists do not assert that humans evolved from the apes you see in the zoo. There are pre modern human ancestors and pre modern gorilla, orangutan, chimpanzee, etc, ancestors all in the class of primates.

    • Budman68

      Cnservatives were created by a loving God whereas liberals descended from apes.

    • Thomas Beckett

      It’s increasingly more apparent to me that liberals are monkeys and are from the parallell universe, a place far away from God.

    • Jackie

      Aw, don’t be so hard on the libs, there is now considerable scientific evidence to support the theory that they are mentally defective with delusions of grandeur (ok, I admit, the last part was just a personal observation).

    • http://doubtingthomas7.blogspot.com Bill

      In at origins debate you must inject political bigotry? Really?

    • Whackajig

      You do not think that humans came from apes?

      Have you never seen a black man? Maybe you are correct and blacks never evolved.

  • WhoCares

    Man is tripartite–body, soul and spirit.

    Why is man higher than an animal? Man has a spirit. An animal does not have a spirit.

    • Evan

      And you know this how?
      An assertion of your religion.

    • R Freeman

      I think I would rather place my faith in a living God that created everything, obey his commands for salvation and after death be right than to believe in evolution, the non-existence of a living God, not obey his commands to be saved, and after death be wrong.

    • Whackajig

      Man is an animal just as is the dog cat and horse. We are a little smarter, but not very much.

  • Steve

    ‘Faith’ as used in the New Testament, and indeed everywhere prior to existentialism does not refer to a blind leap in the dark, or pretending that something is true.

    Rather it is cognate with feality, keeping faith. It is trust, not baseless belief.

    Further, creation model science is not based on believing against data, it is experimental science and historical science using the same scientific methods as those using the other major operatant paradigm: philosophical materialism.

  • Evan

    Yes, as in, keeping the faith in spite of what evidence may be.
    “Further”, God did it, is not a scientific explanation for anything.

    • Budman68

      But “it just happened” IS a scientific explanation?

    • Evan

      No, it’s called physics.

    • Jake

      So it was the Laws of Physics that just happened. Now it is so clear to me. Is it OK with you if I call the one who wrote the Laws of Physics God? And if He decided to create the universe using those Laws or some other method, is it OK if I call that a miracle? Or do I have to bow down and kiss every scientist’s theory writing butt because they think they have it all figured out? And then when we find out our theories are wrong (as science has a long history of) can I stop kissing the first guy’s but or maybe you could just point me to what butt to kiss because by then my head might be so far up his ass I’ll miss the memo that he got it wrong.

    • Evan

      If you want to fantasize about an author of physics where none is needed go ahead but whatever you do keep your head up your own ass for visions of your God.

    • http://doubtingthomas7.blogspot.com Bill

      You can believe anything you want to believe. You can teach whatever you like in Sunday schools. What you cannot do is present you faith as fact in a science class in a public institution.

      If tomorrow you were to be able to teach creationism in such a manner how would you do it? Would you teach the Christian version of creationism? Would you give equal time to every other religion that has ever had a creation story? After all they would all then be equally valid “theories”.

    • R Freeman

      Neither is the un-witnessed THEORY of evolution. No animal, fish or fowl has ever transmutated into another species. Nor has any man ever witnessed such a thing happening. The bible plainly speaks of each to reproduce after their KIND. This makes much more sense to me.

    • Whackajig

      I used to have a dog we called “porky”. We called him that because he liked to hump pigs.

  • Ford

    Maybe your God or even mine created you and me by using evolution just as God uses gravity to keep your feet planted on the surface of the earth.

    • http://doubtingthomas7.blogspot.com Bill

      If that is the case then the Bible is not literally true. The Story in Genesis is just a parable. If that is that case then any other story in the Bible might also be a parable, including the Gospels. Are you really ready to admit that?

    • Whackajig

      Let’s discuss something more serious.

      Like whether or not farts have lumps.

  • G K

    Look at the bright side of the climate change debate: It’s one scientific mystery where big government ideologues all favor “creation” over “evolution.” Agenda is everything.

  • tony

    Why is it that no one has ever witnessed evolution? Not even in a human controlled experiment? Why is it that we can witness creation anytime, any day, anywhere in the world every day of our lives? If chaos is the
    “norm” in the universe, then who created order? Conversely, if order is the “norm” throughout the universe, then why would there be a need for random evolution? Ask your Liberal friends to answer that!

    • http://doubtingthomas7.blogspot.com Bill

      You have witnessed creation? You have witnessed something being created from nothing? You actually SAW God do this?

      No you haven’t. What you see are the after effects and you assign a cause. No one has ever witnessed the Biblical creation either.

    • Whackajig

      Evolution is the gradual change exibited in species over a long period of time. I once toured Ireland and marveled at the structure of the buildings constructed during the 1300s and 1400s. Doorways, stairs and many other things reflected the much smaller frames of the people of those times. We have evolved into a much larger species, or did God decide He needed bigger people?

      Maybe if God would quickly change us into tiny liliputian people, we’d have more than enough natural resources to go around.

  • am2sweet

    Actually I don’t think either evolution or creation needs to be taught unless done so with an unbiased view on both. Religion belongs in our homes and churches. It’s that separation everyone has hollered about. Either teach a little of both or leave both alone. Right now teachers want kids to think they just came from some monkey. That doesn’t sit well with people who believe the Bible and don’t want their kids being taught something different.

    • http://doubtingthomas7.blogspot.com Bill

      So you want no teaching of scientific theories that contradict the Bible?

      That is pretty much why the church persecuted Galileo. He had this nasty unBiblical theory that the Earth revolved around the Sun. Should we stop teaching that one too?

    • Whackajig

      You stupid shit, he is advocating an equal treatment of both views.

      Don’t fly off the handle missy until you understand the post.

    • http://doubtingthomas7.blogspot.com Bill

      Both views? So we should teach that the Earth revolves around the Sun AND the Biblical view that the Sun revolves around the Earth?

    • R Freeman

      A theory, a theory. What is a theory? Oh, I know … it is a guess. Oh, how many times in history have theorists been eventually proven wrong? Pow! Another theory pops up! Why do so many place so much faith in believing a theory of any kind is a FACT? It is only a theory and thus cannot be proven.

  • http://rebelforiam.com m. sharpe

    I only have one little problem with those who push evolution: They are Progressives/Atheist/Communist, that is the objective;Get rid of all things Jesus Christ.So they start with State sponsered schools to mis-educate the young. There should be a line between School and State.

    • am2sweet

      You are correct. I call then Nazis. We have way too many of them in this country.

    • http://doubtingthomas7.blogspot.com Bill

      From reading your post it almost sounds as if you think the Government should be teaching Jesus in schools. Theocrasy?

      Who is miseducating the young? Is anyone coming to your Sunday Schools and teaching evolution? Teach your young what you want but by what right to do attempt to force others to learn your creed?

    • Whackajig

      Horse obama, it is perfectly acceptable to have God and science co-existing.

  • RickB_GA

    I am amazed we are still debating this issue in the 21st century. I believe there are many routes to God and no one religion has a lock on the board. Thank goodness I got out of this conversation about 50 years ago. I did not even know it was still happening. And my dog will join me in the “hereafter”, whatever that might be, when the time comes.

    The word “prove” gets used a lot on this board. I would challenge the “Christians” to “prove” the Bible is the word of God rather than the word of God as man would have wanted him to say it.

    Come on guys and gals … let’s move out of the dark ages.

    • Ron

      The Bible is the only religious text on that planet where the future was predicted, and it actually came to pass exactly as predicted hundreds of years before, in some cases to the very day! In fact, there are over 700 prophecies of Christ’s coming in the old testament, none of which was written less than 400 years before his birth. People have been trying to disprove that ever since, by saying things like they were written after the fact, etc. But when *scientists* (the high priests of the new religion) discovered the Dead Sea Scrolls and dated them as actually being placed there hundreds of years before the time of Christ, and when they translated said scrolls and discovered that they were virtually word for word the same as the modern Bible, they stopped trying to disprove Bible prophecy. I’m not going to list the prophecies here for you – you’ll have to read them for yourself. Be not afraid to find the truth! Ask and you will receive!

    • http://doubtingthomas7.blogspot.com Bill

      the problem with you argument Ron is that you are saying the Bible is self proving. Of course the New Testtament fulfills the prophecies of the Old. When selecting which books to include in the Bible they were choosen for that purpose, among others. Books and writings which contradicted these things were omitted and systematically destroyed. To possess these texts was considered heresey.

      It say more about the early church than it does the truth of Bible.

    • R Freeman

      I find it amazing that thus far almost all the writings in the Bible have been proven scientifically to be accurate. Science can prove the Bible easily enough. I do not believe science has ever disproved anything in the Bible,…. it has only proved that the writers recorded events accurately.

  • Julian

    I think most people are missing the point here. Why is this debate always presented as a choice. The underlying question is always “Do you believe religion or science?” Why the division, why not believe both? The truth is that God is the ultimate scientist. He invented science. Christians should embrace science. Atheists seem to think that science disproves God, but it doesn’t. I’m a Christian and I believe a lot of what evolutionary theory says. If evolution ends up being proven true, so what, that does not disprove God. God could have created everything via an evolutionary process, in fact it appears that may be the case based on some of the evidence. A lot of the claims of evolution are absolutely provable and true, but so what. Evolution does not explain how mater and energy came into existence out of nothing. Evolution cannot explain how the first cell arranged itself into a perfect machine. Even more simple than that evolution cannot explain how amino acids formed into the first protein, which is mathematically impossible. Christians need to stop being so defensive when it comes to science. Diffuse the whole argument by just realizing that science does not disprove God. Be secure in the fact that the more we learn about creation the more impossible it is to explain without a creator. Christians need to stop resisting science so much and just agree with the findings if the evidence is there. Remember that the Bible is not a science book and was never intended to be. God does not explain in the Bible how he created everything. Christians need to stop interpreting creation stories in the Bible literally. They were written to very simple people with no understanding of science at all. I believe God condescended to the level of the people he was talking to when the creation account was told. Just like I condescend to my 3 year old when he asks where the sun goes at night. When my son is 30 will he call me a liar for telling him that the sun went beddy-bys at night when he was 3?, No of course not. He’ll understand that I was talking to him at his level. God didn’t explain physics and biology to Moses for crying out loud, they never would have understood that. He spoke to them on their simple level that’s all.

    • http://doubtingthomas7.blogspot.com Bill

      You are correct science does not disprove God. It never will disprove God for several reasons.

      1. Absent all knowledge about everything (in short being what believer purport God to be). You cannot prove a negative.

      2. The theory and the belief in God are contingent on God’s existence outside science. Putting aside the origins for a second scientifically one cannot walk on walk, command the wind to part a sea or rise from the dead after three days. Can’t be done, yet Christians believe that these things occured. These things will never be taught in science class. When learning the properties of water we will not learn that all humans sink except one.

      Why then to Christians insist that this element of their faith be taught as fact?

  • http://adrianvance.blogspot.com Adrian Vance

    When we have a carbon chemistry that has the kind of variability seen and a scale of time that is virtually infinite anything is possible.

    Take in your arms one invalid or terminally ill child and tell me about your God.

    For conservative political analysis, science and humor see The Two Minute Conservative at http://adrianvance.blogspot.com Now on Kindle.

    • Julian

      Take the same terminally ill child into your arms and tell them they are about to go into oblivion, that there is nothing after their painfull life ends, it that what you are advocating? Explaining why horrific and tragic things happen is not very difficult, but most Christians fail to answer those questions adequately. There are anwers to those who have ears to hear, but most don’t really want to know the truth.

  • http://doubtingthomas7.blogspot.com Bill

    I guess the real question is what do people want?

    Do you want ALL creation myths taught in Science class? (Forgive the term myth, however Christians will agree with me that all creation stories but theirs are myths so what other term can I use) They have a class for that it is called philosophy.

    To any real Christians out there: I honestly want to know, what is your objection to teaching evolution in science class? How does it affect you or your family or community or church?

    • Julian

      I’m a Christian and I say science (evolution) should be taught in the classroom. My son is in grade school and I want him to learn all of what science has to offer. That may have something to do with the fact that I personally don’t believe the literal creation account of a 6,000 year old earth and all that and don’t want that taught in schools. I do believe in a creator and I do believe that any student of science must live with their head in the sand to deny that what they are seeing is created. But schools should only be teaching current scientific theory. However, I don’t think teachers and professors should be spouting off in class about their atheist beliefs either. When I was at the University or Arizona my Biology professor would go on rants all the time about his atheist beliefs. I was an atheist myself at the time and still found it inappropriate. Just leave both beliefs out of the science classroom and let the students do their own investigations into whether or not a creator exists. On that note I think it was either Watson or Crick of DNA fame that said that he must remind himself daily that what he is looking at is not created. Well if you have to do that maybe it’s time to consider some other possibilities. People should follow the truth wherever it leads. If it leads you to believe there is no God, fine, but don’t refuse to look at all the evidence. And that goes for Christians as well, who shouldn’t dismiss science so quickly.

  • Julius

    Ask an evolutionist this question and see if you can get a solid, sane answer. “If humans evolved from apes, why is this evolution still happening?” God created man and woman and gave them the ability to recreate and procreate, and they are still doing it, so indications lead one to believe that evolutionist are either homosexual or lesbians.

  • http://www.thoughtsandcommentary.com Dale Netherton

    Questioning Evolution?? Where is the questioning in faith defined as unquestioning belief?

  • carl hurst

    Evolution is real simple, everything happened accidently out of nothing. Isn’t it humorous that some scientists devote theirwhole lives to trying to create life in a test tube to prove that it didn’t take intelligence to create life.